What happened at the school budget hearing last night?
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PostPosted: Sun, Mar 28 2010, 1:13 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

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So what does anyone think will happen if we vote not to pass this budget? If it doesn't pass & gets revised, is it voted on again by the citizens?

Can't they have one after school bus for Princeton rather than two as opposed to zero?

What clubs are they talking about? The ones we PAY for?

How on earth does 15 minutes in the morning cost significant money?This will be a traffic nightmare.


If it does not get passed. There will be further reductions. Nothing can be added back in. It then goes before the township committee to ok the further cuts and then passed along to the county. There will be not be another vote.

It is important that nothing that has been cut can be added in after it goes down. Only additional cuts.


So your telling us if we vote NO to the school budget this year, then all that happens is that there is another round of review to possibly trim some more fat by the TC? That doesnt sound at all bad, and done by a 3rd party with more objective analysis - even have some folks with financial background from the TC question some of the school budget decisions, I think that's awesome. Why havent we done this before?
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PostPosted: Sun, Mar 28 2010, 1:44 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

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Linda Greenstein said she wanted to raise taxes at the meeting. That was her solution to offset the tax increase.


She was talking about the tax on people making more than 400k that expired.
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PostPosted: Sun, Mar 28 2010, 1:57 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

It seems to me that we need to be looking at cuts that are sustainable. The governor's message seems to be that people need to make "hard" choices and cut those things that we really can't afford.

Now of course the governor is talking out both sides of his mouth on this one -- on the one hand he wants towns to make real cuts and not pass on tax increases - on the other hand he wants teachers to take a wage freeze to make up for the cuts -- such a freeze is not sustainable and is really just a band aid fix. The very kind of fix the governor belittles Corzine for making.

But for our little town I would say this -- don't expect the money back next year. Make cuts we can live with and not ones that just inflict "pain" for a year.

Some of the cuts seem to be sustainable (literacy coach, LA teacher, Math teacher, gym teacher cut backs, first second grade French) especially considering declining enrollment. Other changes seem to be unsustainable. The early AM drop off really does alleviate traffic in town and make the whole drop off process safer, and clearly the high school students need to be able to participate in after school activities -- students whose parents work should not be limited in their participation because they don't have a ride. We chose this school so far away, we need to provide afternoon transportation. We also need to provide for a safe place for students to wait for a bus or parent.

Those cuts that are not sustainable should be added back in and we should increase our tax levy accordingly. If we need it, we have to pay for it. That's how it works.

Now note, the teacher give backs are not sustainable -- and we can only hope the governor gives back some $$ next year. But I wouldn't count on it .
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Guest






PostPosted: Sun, Mar 28 2010, 2:41 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:
So what does anyone think will happen if we vote not to pass this budget? If it doesn't pass & gets revised, is it voted on again by the citizens?

Can't they have one after school bus for Princeton rather than two as opposed to zero?

What clubs are they talking about? The ones we PAY for?

How on earth does 15 minutes in the morning cost significant money?This will be a traffic nightmare.


If it does not get passed. There will be further reductions. Nothing can be added back in. It then goes before the township committee to ok the further cuts and then passed along to the county. There will be not be another vote.

It is important that nothing that has been cut can be added in after it goes down. Only additional cuts.


So your telling us if we vote NO to the school budget this year, then all that happens is that there is another round of review to possibly trim some more fat by the TC? That doesnt sound at all bad, and done by a 3rd party with more objective analysis - even have some folks with financial background from the TC question some of the school budget decisions, I think that's awesome. Why havent we done this before?


Nope you still don't get it. A TC and County ed office must sign off on it. They usually just ask the BOE to cut more money. Sometimes, interestingly they don't cut more, but that is rare. In the future they will probably end up going straight to the County but currently they still go through the TC. Important to understand it is the BOE that will make further cuts. At the meeting they did not indicate where those would be. They did mention that the teachers give backs allowed full day Kindergarten to be maintained. Draw your own conclussion.
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Guest






PostPosted: Sun, Mar 28 2010, 3:12 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

When my prior town voted it down, the BOE and TC/Mayor all met. They discussed in open session the cuts and where they could be made and the impact. They did not tell the BOE cut another 3% or 5%. What you describes sounds easier, but I based on my limited experience it did not work that way. Maybe Cranbury did that one time when the budget was voted down. I don't see anything to be afraid of in a no vote. I don't think our TC would simply say take 2% off and be done with it.
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Guest3
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PostPosted: Sun, Mar 28 2010, 5:19 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

Guest wrote:
So what does anyone think will happen if we vote not to pass this budget? If it doesn't pass & gets revised, is it voted on again by the citizens?

Can't they have one after school bus for Princeton rather than two as opposed to zero?

What clubs are they talking about? The ones we PAY for?

How on earth does 15 minutes in the morning cost significant money?This will be a traffic nightmare.


My understanding is that the 8am opening was something that had been worked out with the police for safety and traffic reasons. I am wondering if the 8:15 opening has been discussed with Kahler?
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cranbury mom
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PostPosted: Sun, Mar 28 2010, 10:12 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

Could someone answer why it gets turned over to the Township Committee if the BOE proposed budget is voted down (sorry I am unfamiliar with this process). Once in the TC hands why do we assume there will be additional cuts if the BOE proposed cuts already accounts for the absence of state aid? Perhaps voting "no" to the BOE budget and allowing the Township Committee to cut the 2-4% pay increases/benefits for the adminstration salaries that are included in the BOE budget is a better scenario? Is anyone able to shed some light?
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Guest 2
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PostPosted: Sun, Mar 28 2010, 10:48 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

The state process calls for any voted down budgets to be reviewed by the TC and then approved by the state. The TC could change NOTHING and simply pass it on to the state. Or they could cut more.

They could not however, cut the teacher's raises. The raises are a contractual obligation. The fact that the teachers gave up 1/2 the raises was a gift, they were not obligated to do so. The TC cannot cut their salaries or their contracted benefits. That is the law. And a good one too.

Why do you feel the teachers need to bear the brunt of the current economic situation? Is it their fault the state has refused to pay into their pension fund for 10 years? Is it their fault the financial system in this country was poorly regulated or that people borrowed too heavily against their homes. Frankly, I would guess there are more residents of this town more directly responsible for that. Say thank you for the give back they have made to the town, vote yes for the budget and pay for the schools you want.
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Robert Zurfluh
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PostPosted: Sun, Mar 28 2010, 11:10 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

It is impossible to save money and not cut certain areas. I think the meeting on friday night was a great opportunity to see the proposed cuts and to comment on it. I have not found friday night's budget PPT on the school website. If anyone has a link to it, or knows when it will be uploaded - I assume as a pdf, please post it here.
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PostPosted: Mon, Mar 29 2010, 7:32 am EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

The teachers should be thanked for taking less than the contracted pay raise, but that pay raise was high anyway given the economic environment. It would have been nice if they had said we'll forgo any raise this year to show our commitment to the kids since many people who pay the school taxes are not getting raises.
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Guest






PostPosted: Mon, Mar 29 2010, 1:25 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:
Linda Greenstein said she wanted to raise taxes at the meeting. That was her solution to offset the tax increase.


She was talking about the tax on people making more than 400k that expired.


Since it expired it would be raising taxes
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Guest






PostPosted: Mon, Mar 29 2010, 1:44 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:
Guest wrote:
Linda Greenstein said she wanted to raise taxes at the meeting. That was her solution to offset the tax increase.


She was talking about the tax on people making more than 400k that expired.


Since it expired it would be raising taxes


Well, if we don't tax the few that make over 400k, then we all have to pay because property taxes will go up. Who can afford paying more in this economy? The richest 1% or the middle class of whom many are struggling these days.

Why should we not tax the rich? I am sorry when I consider individuals making more than 400k rich....I am sure some people disagree with that view. Historically, the federal top tax bracket (especially 1932-1986) was 50-94%. And way back then, the rich seemed to be doing ok. So, with the federal tax rate as low as it is, I think they richest 1% can pay a little more to the State. Sorry, but I don't feel any sympathy towards the few and their cries of injustice. I feel bad for the fixed income seniors or the unemployed worker that is going through his savings to make ends meat.
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PostPosted: Mon, Mar 29 2010, 2:17 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

Amen.
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PostPosted: Mon, Mar 29 2010, 2:43 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

I don't make $400k, but I don't want the people who do to leave the state, either. The ledger did a report on the loss of tax revenue as a result of losing high income households. According to the ledger (a well known conservative think-tank akin to Fox News), it costs more to alienate the rich than it does to encourage them to stay.
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PostPosted: Mon, Mar 29 2010, 2:51 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

Does anyone think that Linda Greenstein's state tax increase plan will bring a fair proporation piece of money back to Cranbury? Is it more efficient to pay Trenton, Greenstein/D'Angelo, more money to give it back to us or is itt better to let Cranbury spend what we feel is appropriate taxing our residents accordingly.
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PostPosted: Mon, Mar 29 2010, 3:08 pm EDT    Post subject: Re: What happened at the school budget hearing last night? Reply with quote

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I don't make $400k, but I don't want the people who do to leave the state, either. The ledger did a report on the loss of tax revenue as a result of losing high income households. According to the ledger (a well known conservative think-tank akin to Fox News), it costs more to alienate the rich than it does to encourage them to stay.


Its not just individuals and couples that are being taxed higher over $400K bracket, it is also Small Business who makeup a majority of the jobs in the state who bear the brunt of this tax. Yes, even in Cranbury there are small business >$400K revenue that will have to pay more taxes (i.e Inn) , and in turn affect who they can hire and for how long. These business people are not rich, they are struggling like the rest of us in NJ to keep staff employed and to paydown high costs of doing business in NJ. That is why many are moving to PA, DE and even some to NY (odd but upstate has better taxes then NJ)
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